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Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)

Posted by: Sigma - Sat Mar 16, 2013 10:00 pm
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Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit) 
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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Fri May 24, 2013 12:50 pm
Sigma wrote:
http://www.gizmag.com/burton-true-3d-laser-plasma-display/20499/

and the atmosphere is the reaction mass :)

Plasma envelope accelerations :D

So, your plan is to fly a TV to the moon? That's a stretch, even for you sigma. The atmosphere doesn't reach all the way to orbit, and Plasma doesn't work like that at all.

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Tue May 28, 2013 7:30 pm
Zeropto is to leave earth orbit with a high payload,

The acceleration is all done while in atmosphere,

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Tue May 28, 2013 10:46 pm
Sigma wrote:
Zeropto is to leave earth orbit with a high payload,

The acceleration is all done while in atmosphere,

And then what? Not being able to manuever means not being able to dock, or do anything else with the payload. What's the point of that?

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sat Jun 01, 2013 3:58 pm
Then you open up your giant spaceship factory in orbit :D

also, a VERY large craft could be launched using Zeropto, and once it reaches orbit, open up solar array, and fire up ION drive :D

Zeropto is just to get to orbit using mainly on ground assests..

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:41 pm
Sigma wrote:
Then you open up your giant spaceship factory in orbit :D

also, a VERY large craft could be launched using Zeropto, and once it reaches orbit, open up solar array, and fire up ION drive :D

Zeropto is just to get to orbit using mainly on ground assests..
Again, you're referring to catch phrases like "Zero Propellant to Orbit" like something we have, when we don't. We don't have the tools to make the tools to make one, and until we do, we have no way of knowing what properties it will have, such as what scale it will work efficiently at.

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:59 pm
Very heavy projectile + LARGE Chemical laser front / Zeropto system

at escape velocity leaving a VERY long gun, with no "Impact" with the atmosphere...

it will be in orbit in a few seconds,

so the energy involved, is not as much in the "ship" besides kinectic energy,

imparted by a maglev launch sled.... inside of a tunnel.

Across the greater part of a continent....

the same system can be used for rapid rail transit, when not launching "zeroptos".


So the real technology here is the sled,
the chemical laser tech already exists.... blooming is actually quite easy...
they are working very hard NOT to bloom right now...

The plasma acceleration tech exists, turn Vasimir inside out...

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:22 am
Less dreaming, more maths please, gentlemen!

I've been half-reading these threads, but without any indication of whether the physics needed is even within an order of magnitude of physical reality, this is not even science fiction, it's fantasy. Here's a challenge: pick one of your ideas, give us some numbers and references, and show that it's at least within the realm of physical reality, even if we don't have the technology to build it and it wouldn't be economically feasible to do so. I know that that's more difficult than idly spouting buzzwords, but if you fancy yourselves engineers, do some engineering!

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sun Jun 02, 2013 4:17 pm
The energy required to move mass out of the way of the craft

Ionization energy required
Image

Energy required to "move" atmosphere out of the way, using wakefield =

Image

I understand this = just slightly less the a rocket BUT THIS IS NOT the "main" energy.... that is momentum,

Momentum = M*v^2 = where the bulk of energy is stored.

this is just to keep a VERY heavy ship from frying......

So, imagine if all of a rocket motor was used to generate a "bubble" around something 5 times heavier then a rocket, already traveling escape velocity....

the energy involved is HUGE however,
the payload can be much greater....

Think of throwing a whole skyscraper into orbit,

now design 1 for zero G and a vacuume, and with radiation shielding....

and lets do it.....

if you were to take a craft, the same weight with no zeropto + a rocket engine, that put out the same power....

it would go VERY fast.... until it was a ball of plasma....

not as fun to ride in the end..... :D

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:55 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... fVS-npfVuY

check this bad dog out :D

Plasma is hard to make though..... not :D

:D

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sun Jun 02, 2013 6:55 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... fVS-npfVuY

check this bad dog out :D

Plasma is hard to make though..... not :D

:D

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:11 pm
I miss Olivia Munn...


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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:45 am
Sigma wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KfVS-npfVuY

check this bad dog out :D

Plasma is hard to make though..... not :D

:D
Flick a bic. See that visual part of the flame? That's plasma. Now, that's a "Dirty" plasma, because it's made up of all the ionized elements of burnt/burning butyl alcohol, and the air it's mixing with, so, if you wanted to control it with microwaves, you'd have to use different frequencies matching the ever changing soup of the plasma you created, while it was expanding, and presumably your craft is heading through it with a supersonic bow shock wave. It won't work, get over it.

Posting equations with multiple variables, but no numbers is not math, it's cut&paste off of wikipedia. How much does your craft weigh? How fast is it moving? These are quantities you need for any equation, even the relatively simple Momentum one. What's it's drag co-efficient? This is a constant decelleration, which constantly lowers your velocity, which the momentum of the ship is based off of.

Momentum is what keeps you in orbit, it doesn't accellerate you to it. Orbit isn't a place, it's a vector perpendicular to the atmosphere, which means you can't launch your ship straight up to orbit, you would have to fire it diagonally through it in a curve that maximizes the drag you're saying would propel the ship. The equations don't work if you substitute the wrong numbers for the wrong factors, either. This isn't real math, it's fantasy.

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Wed Jun 05, 2013 2:13 pm
Momentum

M*V^2

10 tons

Sqr rt 2*G*M/R

-drag

but
the issue here,

is that the system - Zeropto DOES NOT ACCELERATE -
The system is designed to keep a ship from incinerating

The craft,is a projectile, this system keeps it from becoming a vapor,

THE ENERGY IS STORED, as mometum besides a chemical laser,

At escape velocity, exiting the atmosphere, would take about 6 seconds...




I don't have enough details yet to see about the power required,
but if you look at the power required to push a rocket engine...

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:03 pm
Momentum is m*v, kinetic energy is 1/2*m*v^2. Also, you're saying that some kind of energy (not sure where it's coming from) is stored as momentum, but that the craft doesn't accelerate. So, what, it's getting heavier?

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Post Re: Zeropto (Zero_Propellant_2_Orbit)   Posted on: Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:19 pm
MAGLEV LAUNCH SLED

MAGLEV LAUNCH SLED

MAGLEV LAUNCH SLED

:D

adds all energy except what zeropto needs to maintain the plasma supercavity....


It's a dart,

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