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AmericasSpacePrize.com

Posted by: el930692 - Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:33 pm
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AmericasSpacePrize.com 
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Post AmericasSpacePrize.com   Posted on: Wed Oct 27, 2004 9:33 pm
http://www.AmericasSpacePrize.com interesting web site :!: :?:

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Post    Posted on: Thu Oct 28, 2004 11:02 am
They make a very valid point though - all we've heard is the announcement from Bigelow, but nothing to back it up. You would think that they would at least have a website for all the press attention. Even DaVinci have a website!

Does anyone agree with the website that perhaps the Bigelow prize is not what it's cracked up to be?

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Post    Posted on: Thu Oct 28, 2004 12:58 pm
dolby_uk wrote:
You would think that they would at least have a website for all the press attention. Even DaVinci have a website!


I don't believe that you're really thinking this through. Several points:

-- Bigelow needs a private manned orbital spacecraft. A private space station essentially demands it. It's not really feasible to build the station without having humans up there directing it (yet -- Robonaut, et al might change that). Announcing a prize that he wasn't planning to back up would buy him nothing. No one is going to spend millions developing a manned orbital ship with the intent of winning the prize until the rules for winning are set in stone. The only thing the announcement buys him is to get people thinking about such a project. That's certainly valuable -- and may be one reason why he made the announcement before having everything ready (the private-space exceitement of the X-Prize obviously was another reason for announcing when he did). In the end, though, the bottom line is that he needs that ship for his space station concept to work.

-- What exactly does publicity buy him? He doesn't need donations. I guarantee that there's not a single company that *can* build such a craft that's unaware of it -- so there's no need for publicity to 'inform' potential competitors. An orbital craft is not going to be built by a couple of guys in their garage.

-- Comparing Bigelow to DVP is a really low blow. He's done something. Bigelow Aerospace exists -- there are multiple habitats built and in testing. He's working closely with NASA and has them on-site frequently working to improve his tech. I can't even imagine why you would think that someone who has a website that is advertising what they can't produce is better than someone who is not advertising what they can. Bigelow is obviously not a Web fanatic. If you look at the website for Bigelow Aerospace -- it's *very* sketchy, and only partially constructed. It's obviously not a primary concern. And as I've said -- there's no reason for it to be. The people he needs to connect with are *not* the ones who will be browsing his web page. If a web page doesn't buy you anything -- why bother with it?


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Post    Posted on: Thu Oct 28, 2004 3:31 pm
I also think a lot of the point is that he doesn't need the ship until his Nautilus modules are ready to ship, and as far as I remember, that's sometime after 2010 (2012 maybe?). There's even a chance that others will reach it without a prize incentive, which would save him the money.

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Post    Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 1:23 pm
The rules for the Americ's space price have just be anounced here they are.

The Rules:


The spacecraft must reach a minimum altitude of 400 kilometers (approximately 250 miles);

The spacecraft must reach a minimum velocity sufficient to complete two (2) full orbits at altitude before returning to Earth;

The spacecraft must carry no less than a crew of five (5) people;

The spacecraft must dock or demonstrate its ability to dock with a Bigelow Aerospace inflatable space habitat, and be capable of remaining on station at least six (6) months;

The spacecraft must perform two (2) consecutive, safe and successful orbital missions within a period of sixty (60) calendar days, subject to Government regulations;

No more than twenty percent (20 percent) of the spacecraft may be composed of expendable hardware;

The spacecraft must complete its two (2) missions safely and successfully, with all five (5) crew members aboard for the second qualifying flight, before the competition’s deadline of Jan. 10, 2010.

The contestant must have its principal place of business in the United States of America.

The Competitor must not accept of utilize government development funding related to this contest of any kind, nor shall there be any government ownership of the competitor. Usin government test facilities shall be permitted.

The spacecraft must complete its two (2) missions safely and successfully, with all five (5) crew members aboard for the second qualifying flight, before the competition’s deadline of Jan. 10, 2010.

see the fullartical at http://space.com/spacenews/businessmond ... 41108.html


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Post    Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 1:57 pm
Hey ... before just cutting and pasting blindly ... why the hell doesn't anyone actually read those rules ... two of them are exactly the same!

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Post    Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 3:36 pm
needs to be edited for both content and typos :)

but, in fairness, the duplication of the 5-person rule is in the original article... THAT author did not edit his or her work.

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Post    Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:18 pm
Wow, the requirement is quite steep! The orbit height required is higher than the ISS. You need to carry more people than the Soyuz! And u need real passengers in the second flight. 5 years to expire.


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Post ASP   Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:33 pm
I also have to agree with koxinga on the requirements. If is going to be accomplished I will call it a miracle. Anyway, if there are companies already involved in projects close to ASP requirements you might see a winner but to start right now with something like that and get it done in five years it’s extremely difficult.

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Post    Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 5:49 pm
koxinga wrote:
Wow, the requirement is quite steep! The orbit height required is higher than the ISS.


No. 400km is pretty much the mean orbit of the ISS.


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Post    Posted on: Mon Nov 08, 2004 9:08 pm
the ISS is I think 268 Miles up? Not Sure, so its fairly close, but it does seem like quite the task.

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Post    Posted on: Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:33 am
I think you are right, I confused miles with kilometers. Ah, the metric system. The ISS's orbit is between 350 - 400km.

It is a tall task. Not just getting up there with 5 people but to develop a automonous docking system as well and all of it in 5 years. The XPrize took nearly a decade (9 years short of a few months) to get to SS1's first flight and this was a team without any funding issues to content with.

While some of the current XPrize teams could in theory scaled upwards (I think), most will probably spend these few years to get their sub-orbital vehicles working and the business going.


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Post    Posted on: Tue Nov 09, 2004 4:03 am
koxinga wrote:
...but to develop a automonous docking system as well and all of it in 5 years.


The requirement didn't stipulate autonomous. Besides that -- the Russians would sell the Kurs system. After all -- it, or a close relation, is already going to be used on the ATV.


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Post    Posted on: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:22 am
Still, a docking system would have to be developed and i think buying the Kurs system would be expensive. Most of the X-Prize teams concentrate on building the rocket that will get them up there and leave the RV to a later stage and the RV is normally quite simple.


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Post    Posted on: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:55 am
Possibly several XPRIZE teams have been working on orbital concepts in theory or in mind while constructing and building suborbital spacecrafts.

I remember posts and threads where Scaled has been supposed to have a prototype allready.

I wouldn't wonder if some of the teams have had an orbital perspective all the years and consider their suborbital spacecraft as the first step only - and SS1 gets Scaled the finances required for the orbit.

Microspace for example simply has switched over their developments to an orbital vehicle. Interorbital is working on the orbit explicitly since years.



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Last edited by Ekkehard Augustin on Tue Nov 09, 2004 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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